From thanatos@dim.com Thu Feb 14 10:00:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: thanatos@dim.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_2); 14 Feb 2002 18:00:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 52574 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2002 18:00:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (216.115.97.171) by m9.grp.snv.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2002 18:00:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO supernova.dimensional.com) (206.124.0.11) by mta3.grp.snv.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2002 18:00:53 -0000 Received: from p38.3c04.pm.dimcom.net (p38.3c04.pm.dimcom.net [206.124.3.198]) by supernova.dimensional.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with SMTP id g1EI0lX16893 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 11:00:49 -0700 (MST) To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: [lojban-beginners] Non-logical AND in Tanru? Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 11:06:07 -0700 Message-ID: <33rn6u8bu5m69k4abv0j59icqvr4ib6fln@4ax.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.7/32.534 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: EWC X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=45881577 X-Yahoo-Profile: thandim2000 On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 09:30:36 EST, pycyn@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 2/14/2002 1:38:49 AM Central Standard Time,=20 >thanatos@dim.com writes: >> Are these statements not nearly identical in meaning? (aside from the >> special rule for observatives) >>=20 >> 1. ta melbi je nixli ckule >> 2. ta ckule co melbi je nixli >> 3. melbi je nixli co ckule befa ta >Yes, but do you need {co} in the third one? Yes and no. Removing the "co" without reordering the tanru is just the first one again in observational form instead of: 4. ckule befa ta melbi je nixli The sumti places of each selbri in a tanru still exist wherever the selbri may appear in a text; the question was how sumti were assigned to those places. The Book never explicitly defines the method for jeks along with saying "this is how sumti are assigned to selbri connected by jeks...". So if "That is a school for beautiful things and also for girls" is an interpretation of {ta melbi joi nixli ckule}, how *does* one achieve "That is a beautiful school and also a girls' school" in the fewest number of syllables? {ta melbi ju'e nixli ckule}? --=20 EWC