Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: [lojban-beginners] Non-logical AND in Tanru?

From: [email-masked]
Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 15:37:22 EST

In a message dated 2/14/2002 12:01:27 PM Central Standard Time, 
[email-masked] writes:

> 4. ckule befa ta melbi je nixli

I would have thought that this needed {co}, unless you really want {ckule} 
modifying {melba je nixli}. If that is what you want, then neither 3 nor 4 
are at all like 1 and 2.
And indeed not readily comprehended: "lo, a this-is-a-school type of 
beautiful thing and girl." It is somewhat easier without the {be fa ta}.

<The sumti places of each selbri in a tanru still exist wherever the
selbri may appear in a text; the question was how sumti were assigned to
those places. The Book never explicitly defines the method for jeks
along with saying "this is how sumti are assigned to selbri connected by
jeks...".>

I suppose this is technically true, though we don't usually don't worry about 
it, since the ambiguity covers most cases but putting the terms in doesn't 
relieve it much. They generally turn out to be "the obvious" or "it doesn't 
matter." Though I tink that figuring the sumti out might be illuminating.

<So if "That is a school for beautiful things and also for girls" is an
interpretation of {ta melbi joi nixli ckule}, how *does* one achieve
"That is a beautiful school and also a girls' school" in the fewest
number of syllables?
{ta melbi ju'e nixli ckule}?>

What exactly is wrong with {ta melba je nixli ckule}? To be sure it can mean 
other things, but this is pretty clearly the first pick. {ju'e}, if it can 
be used here, such makes the ambiguity worse.