From iad@xxxx.xxx.xxx Tue Sep 28 18:47:00 1999 X-Digest-Num: 247 Message-ID: <44114.247.1355.959273825@eGroups.com> Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:47:00 -0700 From: Ivan A Derzhanski la .ivan. cusku di'e > > [_Türkiye_] is an Arabic toponym, and if it is to be made into > > a cmene, the natural choice for a final consonant is {t}. > > The only Turkish dictionary I have in the office is the one without the > etymological notes, so I'm on shaky ground here. "Türk" is obviously > Turkic, and the "iye" suffix certainly looks like the Arabic feminine > ending (most commonly found in Turkish in personal names [...]). Actually, it's a sequence of two Arabic suffixes: a derivative one (as in _Iraq-i_) and an inflexional one indicating feminine gender: <-Iy-aT>. The final is [t] except before pause, where it's [h] or nothing. > On the other hand, I wouldn't want to get etymological with cmene > and fu'ivla. [...] A final consonant needs to be as unobtrusive > as possible, so I'd still go for {s}. Acoustically a voiceless sibilant is about as obtrusive as they get, and it makes the name sound sort of Greek, which in this case is almost obscene (you know why). I'd rather cauterise a cmene by something motivated from the point of view of the source language (the way Nic^jo N. called himself {nitcion.}, making use of a consonant-final inflected form of his Esperanto name, rather than attach a random consonant to the vowel-final citation form). > Incidentally, {turkiet} sounds a bit too much like > "Türkiyat", the old word for "Türkoloji" for my tastes. The similarity is due to more than chance: both contain a feminine /t/ (though in the other word it seems to be the plural <-At>). --Ivan