From phma@webjockey.net Mon Apr 29 14:05:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: phma@ixazon.dynip.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_3_1); 29 Apr 2002 21:05:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 43020 invoked from network); 29 Apr 2002 21:01:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Apr 2002 21:01:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO neofelis.ixazon.lan) (208.150.110.21) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Apr 2002 21:01:41 -0000 Received: by neofelis.ixazon.lan (Postfix, from userid 500) id 89F253C475; Mon, 29 Apr 2002 17:01:33 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To: lojban Subject: Re: [lojban] What's the logic behind Lojban's sound system? Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2002 17:01:32 -0400 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <02042922572600.01165@localhost.localdomain> In-Reply-To: <02042922572600.01165@localhost.localdomain> X-Spamtrap: fesmri@ixazon.dynip.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02042917013207.01998@neofelis> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: phma@ixazon.dynip.com From: Pierre Abbat X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=92712300 On Monday 29 April 2002 15:57, Robin Turner wrote: > On Monday 29 April 2002 18:44, And Rosta wrote: > > #>The phonology of /'/ and /@/, where /@/ = buffer vowel is so stupid > > #>-- so unlike anything in natlangs -- that it is simply indefensible. > > I don't know about that. Colloquial Turkish uses a short "i" (that's an > English "i", not a Lojban "i"!) or occasionally "ü" to buffer foreign > words, e.g. "film" is often pronounced "filim" and "studyo", "sütüdyo". The buffer vowel is something used by foreigners when pronouncing Lojban, not by jbopre when pronouncing foreign words. The latter is usually /y/ in cmene; fu'ivla (which can't contain "y") add other vowels, change voicing or other features of consonants, etc. So would you insert "ü" or "I" as a buffer vowel? What are some Lojban words that are hard for Turks to pronounce? phma