From jjllambias@hotmail.com Thu Jul 04 10:41:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_7_4); 4 Jul 2002 17:41:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 13387 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:41:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jul 2002 17:41:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.215) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:41:51 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:41:51 -0700 Received: from 200.49.74.2 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 17:41:51 GMT To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: [lojban] pro-sumti question Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 17:41:51 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jul 2002 17:41:51.0242 (UTC) FILETIME=[144286A0:01C22382] From: "Jorge Llambias" X-Originating-IP: [200.49.74.2] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=6071566 X-Yahoo-Profile: jjllambias2000 la pycyn cusku di'e >On {remei} as a solution, note also that {remei} refers to a mass and thus >would be true if only one of the pair had the property in question. The >result wanted would require something like {piro le remei cu tatpi}. I disagree with both statements. Starting with the second, {le remei} and {piro le remei} refer to the same thing: the pair as a whole. To claim something for each member we can use {ro lu'a le remei}. The Book says that the default for {lei} is {pisu'o} instead of {piro} (which would be the correct default) but this does not apply in this case since the gadri we're using is {le}. {le remei} is the pair, not some part of the pair. As for the first claim, it is based on the wrong idea that properties of the members are automatically properties of the mass. This is clearly not so for many properties, and I don't see why one member being tired should make the pair tired. mu'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com