From xod@thestonecutters.net Mon Aug 19 08:24:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_7_4); 19 Aug 2002 15:24:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 30592 invoked from network); 19 Aug 2002 15:24:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Aug 2002 15:24:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Aug 2002 15:24:39 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.05) id 17goOV-0007h3-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 19 Aug 2002 08:24:39 -0700 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 17goNq-0007gi-00; Mon, 19 Aug 2002 08:23:58 -0700 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 19 Aug 2002 08:23:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [66.111.194.10] (helo=granite.thestonecutters.net) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 17goNl-0007gZ-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 19 Aug 2002 08:23:53 -0700 Received: from localhost (xod@localhost) by granite.thestonecutters.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g7JFNpb67353 for ; Mon, 19 Aug 2002 11:23:51 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from xod@thestonecutters.net) Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2002 11:23:51 -0400 (EDT) To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: Re: [lojban] .uanai ne'i le velcli In-Reply-To: <20020819150644.GA29865@allusion.net> Message-ID: <20020819111707.E67193-100000@granite.thestonecutters.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-archive-position: 685 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: xod@thestonecutters.net Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list From: Invent Yourself Reply-To: xod@thestonecutters.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=110189215 X-Yahoo-Profile: throwing_back_the_apple On Mon, 19 Aug 2002, Jordan DeLong wrote: > On Mon, Aug 19, 2002 at 09:14:47AM -0400, pycyn@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 8/19/2002 5:49:13 AM Central Daylight Time, > > lojban-out@lojban.org writes: > [...] > > The question is, first, whether one is here *expressing* an obligation or > > merely *reporting* that one has (or had) one. I think that {ei} only > > expresses and that this case is too deeply buried to be an expression, hence > > the need to state the obligation openly. Secondly, the question is whether > [...] > > I had this same argument with xorxes already on jboste (bau la > lojban. though so it wasn't quite this lame). Check CLL chapter > 2, he's right -- certain attitudinals modify the meaning of the > bridi instead of just expressing how you feel. ".ei" is one of the > former. If I recall properly, the result of a long argument on this list is that the distinction between pure emotion indicators and propositional attitude indicators is more of a suggestion, or a set of defaults, rather than a guaranteed policy. -- China's longest-serving political prisoner, Wang Wanxing, 52, is being held at the Ankang Psychiatric Hospital for treatment of Political Abnormality Illness.