From Philip.Newton@datenrevision.de Tue Aug 20 00:50:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: Philip.Newton@datenrevision.de X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_7_4); 20 Aug 2002 07:50:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 41674 invoked from network); 20 Aug 2002 07:50:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Aug 2002 07:50:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO spree.gedas.de) (139.1.44.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Aug 2002 07:50:29 -0000 Received: from spree.gedas.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by spree.gedas.de (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA21902 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:50:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from blnsem05.de.gedas.vwg (blnsem05.gedas.de [139.1.84.49]) by spree.gedas.de (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA21898 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:50:27 +0200 (MET DST) Received: by blnsem05.de.gedas.vwg with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:50:27 +0200 Message-ID: To: "'lojban@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: Re: I like chocolate Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:50:26 +0200 Return-Receipt-To: "Newton, Philip" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" From: "Newton, Philip" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=23036112 X-Yahoo-Profile: elder_newton la xorxes. cu cusku di'e > > la filip cusku di'e > > > {mi nelci lezu'o citka loi cakla} > > The article {le} indicates that you liked one particular > occasion (or each of the particular occasions you have in > mind) of eating chocolate. To say that you like eating > chocolate generically, I would suggest {lo'e} instead of > {le}. zo'o do ba'e roroi stidi zo lo'e > Also you can say {mi nelci lo'e cakla} directly. But then I'm saying "I like chocolate", aren't I? But I don't necessarily like looking at it, or its colour; it's not an abstract appreciation the way one might like a picture in an art gallery. Eating it is what I like about chocolate. > As for {citka loi cakla} vs {citka lo cakla}, I don't see > much difference. Some quantity of chocolate, or several > quantities taken together. I suppose that you like it so much > that you prefer to eat several quantities at once? How do you get the "several quantities at once"? I took the {loi} from a half-remembered notion (I think it was from the lessons) which uses {loi vanju}, with an explanation something like "one only drinks part of the mass of all that is wine", or something like that. >From which I generalised that {loi} is used for things which are not discrete -- after all, I don't eat one or two chocolates in English; I eat (some) chocolate (mass noun, not count noun). I figured it would be similar in Lojban. So would it be {mi nelci lo'ezu'o citka loi cakla}, then? And can {nelci} even be used like this? The gi'uste says x2 is (object/state), not (activity) or (event), so I'm not sure whether {zu'o} is appropriate here. ("(state)" sounds as if {za'i} is called for -- but I don't like the state of eating chocolate, but rather the activity.) .uanairu'e mu'omi'e filip. [email copies appreciated, since I read the digest] {ko fukpi mrilu .i'o fi mi ki'u le du'u mi te mrilu loi notseljmaji} -- filip.niutyn. All opinions are my own, not my employer's. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.