From pycyn@aol.com Fri Sep 20 18:57:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: Pycyn@aol.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 21 Sep 2002 01:57:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 80301 invoked from network); 21 Sep 2002 01:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Sep 2002 01:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Sep 2002 01:57:23 -0000 Received: from Pycyn@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.10.) id r.cb.289e160a (4468) for ; Fri, 20 Sep 2002 21:57:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2002 21:57:20 EDT Subject: Re: [lojban] bloti/marce To: lojban@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_cb.289e160a.2abd2c00_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10509 From: pycyn@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2455001 X-Yahoo-Profile: kaliputra --part1_cb.289e160a.2abd2c00_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I confess to not following this diacussion carefully, but I note that {bloti} is perfectly normal within Lojban, joining {carce} and {karce} and (but with terms reversed) {jakne} and probably a few more for types of carriers defined by their normal load and their power source. They are grouped together, but not named, in the three-termed gismu list. Now, these seem to me to be very odd definitions for "boat" and "cart" and "car" and even "rocket." Boat.in particular, lacks all the things that makes a boat a boat (and don't even bring up "ship" -- "big boat," indeed!). Whether the real things can be recovered or not, is not clear. What is secondarily clear is that, were real boat-centered boat words to be had, {bloti} could be nicely covered by a lujvo ending in {marce} (but this kind of compenential analysis was not at the heart -- or, sometimes, even at the periphery) of the definition process. For now, then, we are stuck with these few specialized conveyances and {marce} for all else -- space ships and flying saucers and wheel barrows and bicycles and ... And chariots and royal coaches are just carts, and curragh are in the same heap as the Enterprise (er, the 20th century's). --part1_cb.289e160a.2abd2c00_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I confess to not following this diacussion carefully, but I note that {bloti} is perfectly normal within Lojban, joining {carce} and {karce} and (but with terms reversed) {jakne} and probably a few more for types of carriers defined by their normal load and their power source. They are grouped together, but not named, in the three-termed gismu list. Now, these seem to me to be very odd definitions for "boat" and "cart" and "car" and even "rocket." Boat.in particular, lacks all the things that makes a boat a boat (and don't even bring up "ship" -- "big boat," indeed!). Whether the real things can be recovered or not, is not clear. What is secondarily clear is that, were real boat-centered boat words to be had, {bloti} could be nicely covered by a lujvo ending in {marce} (but this kind of compenential analysis was not at the heart -- or, sometimes, even at the periphery) of the definition process. For now, then, we are stuck with these few specialized conveyances and {marce} for all else -- space ships and flying saucers and wheel barrows and bicycles and ... And chariots and royal coaches are just carts, and curragh are in the same heap as the Enterprise (er, the 20th century's). --part1_cb.289e160a.2abd2c00_boundary--