From lojban-out@lojban.org Thu Oct 10 13:53:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 20:53:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 51290 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 20:53:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 20:53:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 20:53:41 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.05) id 17zkNQ-0003Ax-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 13:57:48 -0700 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 17zkMm-0003Ae-00; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 13:57:08 -0700 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Thu, 10 Oct 2002 13:57:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from manyas.bcc.bilkent.edu.tr ([139.179.30.24]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 17zkMi-0003AV-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 13:57:04 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by manyas.bcc.bilkent.edu.tr (Postfix) with ESMTP id A399B12B7E for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:52:50 +0300 (EEST) Received: from bilkent.edu.tr (ppp27.bcc.bilkent.edu.tr [139.179.111.29]) by manyas.bcc.bilkent.edu.tr (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAB6812B5D for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:52:47 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <3DA5E9D3.9040009@bilkent.edu.tr> Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:57:55 +0300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.8) Gecko/20020204 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: if this be error and vpon me provd (was: RE: Re: [Announcement] The Alice Translation Has Moved And Changed References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS snapshot-20020300 X-archive-position: 2127 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: robin@bilkent.edu.tr Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list X-eGroups-From: Robin Turner From: Robin Turner Reply-To: robin@bilkent.edu.tr X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790 X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out And Rosta wrote: > Lojbab: > >>As for the question of errors, if it violates the baseline, then by >>definition it IS an error, assuming that the baseline has any meaning >>whatsoever. >> > > It is not an error if witting and deliberate. We don't say that, say, > the language of Finnegans Wake errs, even if it is ungrammatical. > > >>So it sounds like you are explicitly advocating public dialectization of >>the language even on issues where there is a clear baseline position if you >>think that position to be wrong, which sounds like out-and-out rejection >>that the baseline has any meaning? >> > > He wasn't, but it is the only solution. Dialectisation the only solution? zo'o Given the size of the Lojban user base, I think dialectisation would result in Lojban testing not the Sapir-whorf hypothesis, but Wittgenstein's argument against the possibility of private languages. robin.tr -- "We do not imprison ourselves with laws, or impoverish ourselves with money" - Iain Banks Robin Turner IDMYO Bilkent Universitesi Ankara 06533 Turkey www.bilkent.edu.tr/~robin