From jjllambias@hotmail.com Wed Oct 16 09:40:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 24775 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:40:12 -0700 Received: from 200.49.74.2 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12 GMT To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: brivla for 'intend' Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Oct 2002 16:40:12.0717 (UTC) FILETIME=[B2BA65D0:01C27532] From: "Jorge Llambias" X-Originating-IP: [200.49.74.2] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=6071566 X-Yahoo-Profile: jjllambias2000 la pycyn cusku di'e >2. This, incidentally, is partly the intersection of {zukte} and {gasnu}: I >zukte this to achieve that, but I gasnu the other, Don't you agree that in that case, I have to be the agent of "this", but need not be (and generally am not) the agent of "the other"? In {ko'a zukte le nu broda}, the claim is that {ko'a} is the agent of the sub-event {nu broda}. We would not say, for example {mi zukte le nu le mlatu cu citka le rectu}, but rather {mi gasnu le nu le mlatu cu citka le rectu}. We would not say {mi gasnu le nu mi citka} unless we were doing something addittional to just eating, like making ourselves eat, would we? The x1 of gasnu is the agent of le nu gasnu, but not of le se gasnu. The x1 of zukte, on the other hand, is the agent of le se zukte. {gasnu} adds an agent place. {zukte} selects the agent from a relationship that already has one. Of course {zukte} is only for volitional agents. {zukte fi zi'o} for selecting agents in general. mu'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access for only $21.95/month.  Try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp