From a.rosta@lycos.co.uk Fri Nov 22 04:12:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 12:12:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 97236 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 12:12:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 12:12:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 12:12:10 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.05) id 18FCfK-0005lN-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 04:12:10 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18FCf8-0005jj-00; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 04:11:58 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Fri, 22 Nov 2002 04:11:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from lmsmtp04.st1.spray.net ([212.78.202.114]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18FCf3-0005jY-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 04:11:53 -0800 Received: from oemcomputer (host81-7-61-89.surfport24.v21.co.uk [81.7.61.89]) by lmsmtp04.st1.spray.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E5447E85 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 13:11:20 +0100 (MET) To: Subject: [lojban] Re: mi nanca li (was: Re: Newbie says hi Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:13:21 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20021122012938.GB11023@digitalkingdom.org> X-archive-position: 2671 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: a.rosta@lycos.co.uk Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list From: "And Rosta" Reply-To: a.rosta@lycos.co.uk X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=122260811 X-Yahoo-Profile: andjamin Robin: > On Thu, Nov 21, 2002 at 11:17:47PM -0000, And Rosta wrote: > > I generally don't understand what "by standard" places mean, but I > > find it hard to construe a "by standard" place as defining the > > event expressed by the x1. > > "I am of time-length 18 years by the standard of that is how long I have > been alive" > > Seems OK, if stilted, to me I prefer xorxes's and pier's story, which is that the standard tells you how the units are defined. I can also accept that it could be used for things like "I'm 6 foot tall *in my stockingfeet*" "I'm 15 1/2 stone *with my kit off*" -- i.e. defining which alternative way of measuring the same thing is used. In measuring the duration of a person, we might say "She lived for 70 years *reckoning from birth (as opposed to conception)*". But for reasons stated in earlier messages, I can't construct a rationale for the usage you propose. It seems one could equally well say "18 years (x2) is the duration of how long I have been alive (x1)"; that is, your x3 does no more than redundantly corefer to x1. --And.