From phma@webjockey.net Fri Dec 06 09:10:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 17:10:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 58795 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 17:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 17:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 17:10:33 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.05) id 18KLzk-0007GT-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 09:10:32 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18KLzD-0007Fy-00; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 09:09:59 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Fri, 06 Dec 2002 09:09:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from 208-150-110-21-adsl.precisionet.net ([208.150.110.21] helo=neofelis.ixazon.lan) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18KLz8-0007FF-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 09:09:54 -0800 Received: by neofelis.ixazon.lan (Postfix, from userid 500) id CE1553C477; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 12:09:18 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To: Subject: [lojban] Re: cmegadri valfendi preti Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 12:09:10 -0500 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <02120414202304.01986@neofelis> <5.1.0.14.0.20021205200740.00ac9740@pop.east.cox.net> <005f01c29d05$7b3e6840$34c70950@tanj> In-Reply-To: <005f01c29d05$7b3e6840$34c70950@tanj> X-Spamtrap: fesmri@ixazon.dynip.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02120612091001.02354@neofelis> X-archive-position: 3139 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: phma@webjockey.net Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list From: Pierre Abbat Reply-To: phma@webjockey.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=92712300 On Friday 06 December 2002 03:56, Lionel Vidal wrote: > Nora LeChevalier: > > I used a backward algorithm because a forward algorithm is susceptible to > > garden-pathing. For example, > > 'miKLAmaleZARcifuleKARcegi'eBEVrileDAKlis' > > is a name, but you don't know it until the final letter. > > I am not sure I really understand the expression 'garden-pathing', but > I do think your example illustrates my point :-) > Suppose you hear it in conditions good enough to identify clearly each > sound and stress: even then you just can't wait for the final 's' to start > the parsing, memorizing all exactly along the way, and seeing with great > relief the final 's', which means you won't have to go through it again > from the beginning! "Garden-pathing" is short for "leading one down the garden path", which is an idiom for leading one down a path with a surprising ending, or something like that. > What I meant by forward parsing, is one forward pass, taking along the > set of remaining possibilities, which is actually very near IMO of the > process followed by humans to parse any language. Humans are not > very good at backtracking over meaningless sounds, but are much > better to do so in a limited way over meaningfull entities. > In your example, some steps of the evolution of the parsing set could be > something like: (* stands for anything, and the rule is that as soon as the > set is a singleton, the parse to that point is done, but you still must > wait till the end of the whole chunk parsing to set the validity flag) Forward parsing does not work well for Lojban because it does not have the prefix property. jbofi'e uses forward parsing; the result is an unwieldy state table and difficult-to-fix bugs (e.g. it accepts {ckankua} as a fu'ivla but does not accept {packankua}, even though it breaks cmavo off lujvo and type-3 fu'ivla). phma