From lojban-out@lojban.org Sat Dec 07 12:43:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 20:43:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 33027 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 20:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 20:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 20:43:05 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.05) id 18Klmz-0007rQ-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:43:05 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18Klmx-0007r7-00; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:43:03 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:43:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.intrex.net ([209.42.192.250]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18Klms-0007qy-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:42:58 -0800 Received: from Craig [209.42.200.12] by smtp.intrex.net (SMTPD32-5.05) id AD57676014A; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 15:43:03 -0500 To: Subject: [lojban] Re: Aesthetics Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 15:42:54 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <20021207153048.M91480-100000@granite.thestonecutters.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Importance: Normal X-Declude-Sender: raganok@intrex.net [209.42.200.12] X-Note: Total weight is 0. Whitelisted X-archive-position: 3234 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: raganok@intrex.net Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list X-eGroups-From: "Craig" From: "Craig" Reply-To: raganok@intrex.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790 X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out >> >Why is [h] not an optimal pronunciation for '? (Yes I know the >> >title of the thread is 'aesthetics', but you seem to be implying >> >there's some kind of reason). >> >> Because there is a greater phonic contrast between [T] and [f] or [s] than >> between [h] and [x]. >Not when [x] is spoken by someone who can do it properly. I can do it properly, but I still hear it as kind of h-like - even out of native German and Spanish speakers. >> I use [T], but only because I can't get the ll sound. >I assume that [T] means thorn? Yes.