From lojban-out@lojban.org Sun Dec 08 15:32:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 23:32:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 47923 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 23:32:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 23:32:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 23:32:02 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.05) id 18LAu2-0007rk-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 08 Dec 2002 15:32:02 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18LAtz-0007rQ-00; Sun, 08 Dec 2002 15:31:59 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sun, 08 Dec 2002 15:31:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from lakemtao04.cox.net ([68.1.17.241]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.05) id 18LAtu-0007qU-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sun, 08 Dec 2002 15:31:55 -0800 Received: from nora.lojban.org ([68.100.206.153]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021208233124.ZTPA1248.lakemtao04.cox.net@nora.lojban.org> for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 18:31:24 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20021208183054.02de4180@pop.east.cox.net> X-Sender: noras@pop.east.cox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 18:34:53 -0500 To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: cmegadri valfendi preti In-Reply-To: <0212081736270A.19670@neofelis> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-archive-position: 3326 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: noras@lojban.org Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list X-eGroups-From: Nora LeChevalier From: Nora LeChevalier Reply-To: noras@lojban.org X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790 X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out At 05:36 PM 12/8/02 -0500, Pierre wrote: >On Sunday 08 December 2002 17:07, And Rosta wrote: > > pier: > > > The problem with section 16 is that it cannot be extended to fu'ivla > > > longer than 6 letters which end in CCVVCV, and is very difficult to > > > extend to longer fu'ivla of whatever form. I have a proposal that works > > > for a large class of fu'ivla, including both CCVVCV and all type-3's that > > > end in a single vowel, and have only to code it up and prove it > > > > Is your proposal on the wiki? Seeing as you are our main fuhivla wonk, > > I imagine that the BF would tend to look to you for 'expert opinion' > > in the first instance. > >It's on the page [rafsi fu'ivla]. Per the Wiki page referenced above: All type-3 fu'ivla ending in a single vowel, and many type-4 fu'ivla such as those of form CCVC/CVCV (e.g. mlongena, eggplant) can also be given rafsi. The rule is: Remove the final vowel and try to resolve what's left into a string of rafsi, all three-letter except possibly for the last which may be four-letter, and possibly with an 'r' inserted after the first if it is CVV (or 'n' if the next letter is 'r'). If this fails, and the fu'ivla begins with a consonant and ends with a single vowel, then the result of removing the final vowel is its rafsi. However, you have not considered how it interacts with the rest of the speech stream. For example, if mlongena + nelci becomes mlongenynei (with stress, mlongEnynei), then 2 of them is "re mlongenynei", which in the speech stream is {remlongEnynei}, which is a lujvo (rem+lon+gen+y+nei). Adding new capabilities for fu'ivla is not as simple as it looks. -- mi'e noras noras@lojban.org Nora LeChevalier