From lojban-out@lojban.org Fri Feb 28 10:14:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 18:14:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 61726 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 18:14:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 18:14:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 18:14:48 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.12) id 18op1z-0003MG-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:14:47 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18op0r-0003Lb-00; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:13:37 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:13:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from rlpowell by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.12) id 18op0g-0003LQ-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:13:26 -0800 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 10:13:26 -0800 To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: Any (was: Nick will be with you shortly) Message-ID: <20030228181326.GS17252@digitalkingdom.org> Mail-Followup-To: lojban-list@lojban.org References: <20030228143808.GA29375@allusion.net> <20030228102803.T4979-100000@granite.thestonecutters.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20030228102803.T4979-100000@granite.thestonecutters.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-archive-position: 4229 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list X-eGroups-From: Robin Lee Powell From: Robin Lee Powell Reply-To: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790 X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out On Fri, Feb 28, 2003 at 10:35:31AM -0500, Invent Yourself wrote: > On Fri, 28 Feb 2003, Jordan DeLong wrote: > > Ok, I'll put it in logic then. b is bob, j is John, N is nitcu, M > > is mikce: > > Nbj > > Mj > > ----- > > Nbj & Mj &-intro > > Ex(Nbx & Mx) E-intro > > Maybe you disagree that the lojban directly corresponds to these > > logical formulae, though that seems to be unlikely. > > If I really need only my family doctor, can I say "mi nitcu lo mikce"? No. Says whom? In what way, exactly, does your family doctor not fit su'o da poi mikce? > You are interpreting "lo mikce" as being valid in cases where I am > holding secret, unspoken criteria *in mind* reducing the actual set of > doctors that I need down some subset of all doctors. It's the English > "There is *A* ... such that..." which is confusing you. You're seeing > this and thinking that it means "There exist one or more doctors that > I need, but the rest can go lump themselves". But that's expressed > with le, not lo. Follow Craig's reduction proof to achieve the proper > understanding of da. Dammit, da *MEANS* there exists! That's the freaking *definition*! It's based entierly on the Ex predicate logic operator being used above! If lojban suddenly stopped being based on Western predicate logic, no-one told me. -Robin -- http://www.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/ *** I'm a *male* Robin. .i le pamoi velru'e zo'u crepu le plibu taxfu .i le remoi velru'e zo'u mo .i le cimoi velru'e zo'u ba'e prali .uisai http://www.lojban.org/ *** to sa'a cu'u lei pibyta'u cridrnoma toi