From ragnarok@pobox.com Fri Feb 28 19:28:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 03:28:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 49392 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 03:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 03:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 03:28:09 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.12) id 18oxfV-00020v-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:28:09 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18oxfB-0001z0-00; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:27:49 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:27:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.intrex.net ([209.42.192.250]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18oxex-0001xB-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:27:35 -0800 Received: from craig [209.42.200.67] by smtp.intrex.net (SMTPD32-7.13) id A8895856014C; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 22:27:05 -0500 To: Subject: [lojban] Re: Any (was: Nick will be with you shortly) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 22:27:10 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <20030228215015.GC17252@digitalkingdom.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Importance: Normal X-Declude-Sender: ragnarok@pobox.com [209.42.200.67] X-archive-position: 4250 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: ragnarok@pobox.com Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list From: "Craig" Reply-To: ragnarok@pobox.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48763382 X-Yahoo-Profile: kreig_daniyl >> >> >> So, you think da is specific, do you? I can't work with you. >> >> >> Carry on. >> >> >> >> >Straight out of the book: >> >> >> >> >4.2) da poi prenu zo'u da viska la djim. >> >> > There-is-an-X which is-a-person : X sees Jim. >> >> > Someone sees Jim. >> >> >> >> But if you ask for da poi prenu zo'u da viska la djim to become >> >> true, you won't care who sees Jim, right? >> >> >Tell me how to ask for that in lojban, and I'll see about answering >> >the question. >> >> .i bai ko le du'u da poi prenu zo'u da la djim viska ku cu jetnu >That isn't a question, that's a command. In my indolect, at least, 'ask for' implies a polite command. Lojban commands are not inherently impolite, so any command will do. The idea is like English 'would you have someone see Jim?' - but in Lojban that is not phrased as a question. >If I were to execute said command, then yes, I would assume that any >prenu would do. However, I wouldn't be completely surprised if the >commander turned out to have a different se jetnu in mind. >Note, however, that the original discussion was about nitcu, with the x3 >unspecified. That makes *all* the difference to me. Therefore the scope of da is limited to the mikce that are acceptable with your ternitcu. However, you do not explain why the unspecified ternitcu makes the difference from 'any doctor' to 'the doctor I have in mind'. >> Easy even for us relative beginners. >Sorry, I meant I wanted to see exactly how you phrased it. Any command form of da poi prenu zo'u da viska la djim would be acceptable. I'd also consider an unmodified statement preceded by doi ko, but I'm not sure if that would be sufficient.