From robin@BILKENT.EDU.TR Mon Jul 17 10:20:23 2000 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7349 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2000 17:20:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.27) by m4.onelist.org with QMQP; 17 Jul 2000 17:20:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO firat.bcc.bilkent.edu.tr) (139.179.10.13) by mta1 with SMTP; 17 Jul 2000 17:20:20 -0000 Received: from bilkent.edu.tr (IDENT:robin@fast3.fen.bilkent.edu.tr [139.179.97.28]) by firat.bcc.bilkent.edu.tr (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id e6HHNCj06427 for ; Mon, 17 Jul 2000 20:23:12 +0300 (EET DST) Sender: robin@Bilkent.EDU.TR Message-ID: <39733F53.62D30F14@bilkent.edu.tr> Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2000 20:16:03 +0300 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.14-5.0 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban@egroups.com Subject: Re: `even' (Re: [lojban] Re: Tashunkekokipapi) References: <8kij16+jpv0@eGroups.com> <397204A7.EE564A82@math.bas.bg> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Robin > "Alfred W. Tueting (Tüting)" wrote: > > --- In lojban@egroups.com, "Jorge Llambias" wrote: > > > In all cases, "even" means that John was the least likely > > > to be expected to come, but he did anyway. The accompanying > > > emotion (surprise, happiness, pity) is independent of "even". > > > > Although I like /ji'acai/, I still feel that surprise somehow > > is part of "even". Maybe there's no real need to express this > > in a Lojban word (as it isn't verbally expressed in any language > > I'm familiar with - but it's in my mind anyway! [...]) "Even" exists in Turkish, but as two words (which I frequently mix up in conversation). "Hatta" expresses the idea of "more than expected" e.g. Her yere baktIm. Hatta c~öplüg~ü bos~altIm. I looked everywhere. I even emptied the rubbish bin. "Bile" carries the sense of an expected action which was not performed e.g. Tes~ekkür bile etmedi. He didn't even thank me. co'o mi'e robin.