Subject: RE: Orcutt (again?!)

From: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 10:18:49 EST

I can't find the file of Orcutt stuff from the last time(s?) and I am not 
sure it is relevant to this go-'round, which seem to be more complicated 
than I can see the need for at the moment. So...
I know that a certain person is named Orcutt, John met a man yesterday and 
now believes that man is a spy. Having observed the meeting, I know that the 
man he met is the one I know as Orcutt, but John does not know this. I can 
say 
Of Orcutt, John believes that he is a spy
la orkyt zo'u la djan krici le du'u ke [spy]
and also
John believes that the man he met yesterday is a spy
la djan krici le du'u le nanmu poi he met him yesterday is a spy
but not 
John believes that Orcutt is a spy
la djan krici le du'u la orkyt [spy]
I do not see the point of all the runs through {ckaji} and the like, though I 
suspect that I caused it all by something I said about individual concepts. 
The point of that is just that in intensional contexts, the reference 
(denotation) of a name is its normal sense (designation), so that, in 
particular, identity replacements do not work with normal coreferents but 
only with normal cosenses. Clearly the coreference of "Orcutt" and "the man 
John met yesterday" does not carry also cosense, so that replacement will not 
hold in the intensional context of {krici}, though some other description of 
the man which was logically equivalent to "the man who John met yesterday" 
would (on the usual run through).
I don't see the connection of any of this to the issue about Maggie Thatcher 
and George Eliot. The differences there are just about the authority or 
sanity or whatever of the believer, not a problem about intensional contexts. 
At the most, you might make a case that the names could not be exported to 
the "as for" format, since the person may not be talking about people he 
thinks are real or he might hold his view even after a close physical 
examination (including chromosome check) of the actual person: la magis fatcr 
zo'u la djan na krici le du'u ko'e du la magis fatcr.