From jjllambias@hotmail.com Sun Mar 18 15:24:24 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@onelist.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_0_4); 18 Mar 2001 23:24:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 44368 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2001 23:24:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.142) by l10.egroups.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2001 23:24:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.4) by mta3 with SMTP; 19 Mar 2001 00:25:28 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 18 Mar 2001 15:24:23 -0800 Received: from 200.41.210.17 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 18 Mar 2001 23:24:23 GMT X-Originating-IP: [200.41.210.17] To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Random lojban questions/annoyances. Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2001 23:24:23 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Mar 2001 23:24:23.0980 (UTC) FILETIME=[9141B6C0:01C0B002] From: "Jorge Llambias" la camgusmis cusku di'e > > (It is not sufficient, for a belief to count as knowledge, that it be >true, > > but it is necessary.) > >Wow. I am _SO_ not with you on this. > >Is this philosophical point of view an inherent aspect of the lojban >language itself? I can hardly see it as a philosophical point of view. {djuno} does not mean "x1 is absolutely certain that x2", it means "x1 knows that x2". If John for some reason is absolutely certain that you live in Australia, then when asked whether he knows where Robin lives, he will answer "yes, I know where he lives, he lives in Australia". That's because he is convinced that "Robin lives in Australia" is true. But I know that's not true, so I can't say "John knows that Robin lives in Australia", I have to say "John is absolutely certain that Robin lives in Australia, but he is wrong, Robin does not live in Australia". I don't see any philosophy behind this, it doesn't even touch the question of what is true or what can be known, it only relates to the question of what {djuno} or "knows" mean. co'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.