From jjllambias@hotmail.com Sun Mar 18 20:06:23 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@onelist.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_0_4); 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 67564 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.27) by l7.egroups.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.25) by mta2 with SMTP; 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 18 Mar 2001 20:06:23 -0800 Received: from 200.41.210.17 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23 GMT X-Originating-IP: [200.41.210.17] To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Knowledge (was: Random lojban questions/annoyances Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Mar 2001 04:06:23.0267 (UTC) FILETIME=[F5F00730:01C0B029] From: "Jorge Llambias" la camgusmis cusku di'e > > It is the same situation. Neither the use of {djuno} nor of {jetnu} > > entails that the speaker is stating a truth. > >Umm, but that's not what the book says. It specifically says that we >cannot know (djuno) anything that is not true. And neither can anything that is not true be {jetnu}. How is that different. Truths can be {jetnu} and {se djuno}. Non-truths cannot be {jetnu} or {se djuno}. People are allowed to make mistakes and believe, until corrected, that non-truths are {jetnu} or {se djuno}. I don't see what the difference is. >That sounds like >the use of djuno entails that the speaker is stating a truth to me. Not to me. Only that the speaker believes to be stating a truth. co'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.