From xod@sixgirls.org Sun Mar 18 20:54:46 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: xod@shiva.sixgirls.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_0_4); 19 Mar 2001 04:54:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 58084 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2001 04:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.26) by l9.egroups.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2001 04:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO shiva.sixgirls.org) (206.252.141.232) by mta1 with SMTP; 19 Mar 2001 04:54:45 -0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by shiva.sixgirls.org (8.11.0/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f2J4Vjh10280 for ; Sun, 18 Mar 2001 23:31:45 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2001 23:31:45 -0500 (EST) To: Subject: Re: [lojban] Knowledge (was: Random lojban questions/annoyances In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Invent Yourself On Mon, 19 Mar 2001, Jorge Llambias wrote: > > la xod cusku di'e > > > > So you want {djuno} to be synonimous with {jinvi} or with {birti}? > > > Why have the word at all? > > > >birti seems like malglico, subsumable under jinvi. > > But some opinions are held with more certainty than others, > {birti} is useful to make that distinction. > A whole gismu to denote a minor deviation of amount in another gismu? Perhaps we could use a gismu for "big dog". > >But why bother djuno, > >since it is only a superposition of krici + tugni? > > krici + jetnu really. {ko'a djuno ko'e} => {ko'a krici ko'e} > & {ko'e jetnu}. > > But Lojban gismu are not supposed to be a minimal set. > There are many superpositions that occur often or were > considered useful for some reason. > > > > Every single Lojban word automatically inserts the judgments of > > > the narrator. Which word doesn't? > > > >krici doesn't. > > It certainly does. If you say that A believes B you are making > a judgment. > Not at all. I am objectively reporting the personal claims of A. "Sophie is a Muslim" is objective fact. "Sophie KNOWS Mohammed is Allah's only prophet" is not objective, because I am sneaking in my own agreement with her. > >It reports on the objective facts. So does tugni. But djuno > >sneaks the narrator's biases in there quietly. > > I don't see any special bias sneaking in with djuno. Nothing > that doesn't sneak in with jetnu. Because if I tell you something is true, the fact that I am saying it means that I think it's true. But in the case of narration, to automatically insert my own judgement is questionable. ----- We do not like And if a cat those Rs and Ds, needed a hat? Who can't resist Free enterprise more subsidies. is there for that!