Subject: Re: [lojban] Knowledge (was: Random lojban questions/annoyances

From: Invent Yourself <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2001 15:17:43 -0500 (EST)

On Mon, 19 Mar 2001, Robert J. Chassell wrote:

> > Not at all. I am objectively reporting the personal claims of A. "Sophie
> > is a Muslim" is objective fact. "Sophie KNOWS Mohammed is Allah's only
> > prophet" is not objective, because I am sneaking in my own agreement with
> > her.
>
> We have been over this before:
>
> every utterance is stated a `universe of discourse'.

Should I assume you meant "There are multiple `universes of discourse'"?
Because the statement as you wrote it, means that every statement is true
according to itself. This is trivial. However, dealing with multiple
`universes of discourse' is interesting.

> The problem occurs because people live in difference universes.
>
> Sophie lives within a universe of discourse in which her knowledge is
> `real'. The statement is unfalsifiable. It addition, it very
> possibly is known to her by internal experience (dream, vision, or
> personal revelation) {se'o}.

The English word "know", when used for "A knows B", means that "A believes
B and A is inside my universe of discourse". Or, "A believes B by the same
epistemology I use, and hence I support his belief".

I can use djuno x4, however, to apply to other universes of discourse. I
can say something that resembles "Sophie KNOWS Mohammed is Allah's only
prophet" while I myself am not a Muslim and don't agree with her at all.

The link, I believe, between Jorge and Robin, is that the default djuno x4
is the narrator's belief system.

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