Subject: Re: [lojban] Random lojban questions/annoyances.

From: "Robert J. Chassell" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 20:25:11 -0500 (EST)

Lojbab:

> The current definition is NOT a single word, and the whole must
> be used to get the meaning. There MUST be an epistemology, ...

Could you explain what an epistemology is, ...

You are being confused by the English. An English dictionary writer
picks the word `know', but the lojban is `djuno' and the word
*requires* that you incorporate an
epistemology in the meaning. The epistemology may be implicit or
explicit, but it is there. If the English word `know' is misleading,
choose another that fits the lojban better for your understanding.

Here is one of the ways that Lojbab defined the word. Replace the word
`know' with something else that works as well or better. I suggest
`apprehend' as a possibility. 

Also, I suggest the phrase `considers X2 highly suggestive about X3 by
epistemology x4', where the phrase `highly suggestive' is one of the
phrases used by David McAllister as one of his metric standards for
`certainty factors' for use in an `expert system' (a type of computer
program). See
http://www.rattlesnake.com/notions/certainty-factors.html

The main point is that lojban words are not like English words; lojban
words incorporate different constraints and references. (This, by the
way, is why I think that any learing program that uses `key words' is
fundamentally flawed. But, of course, the disadvantage of following
my belief is that you end up having to do more work. This why people
like me don't have the time to study lojban vocabulary, even though
good programs exist, such as Emacs Flashcard mode. This is why I
hardly ever write to this list and still don't know contemporary
lojban.)

Here is the definition for `djuno' as it is defined in the standard
gimu list; but try substuting `apprehend' and the longer McAllister
phrase for the word `know'. And please think of some better word than
`apprehend'; I don't like it.

* know how to (not necessarily with capability), 
x1 knows fact(s) x2 (du'u) about subject x3 by epistemology x4
/:/ [words usable for epistemology typically have a du'u
place; know how to - implying knowledge of method but not
necessarily having the ability to practice (= tadjyju'o)]
(cf. know how to/familiar with: se slabu, na'e cnino, na'e
fange; also cf. cmavo list du'o, cilre, certu, facki, jijnu,
jimpe, senpi, smadi, kakne, birti, mipri, morji, saske) /=/
djuno (jun ju'o)

-- 
Robert J. Chassell [email-masked]
Rattlesnake Enterprises http://www.rattlesnake.com