From jjllambias@hotmail.com Sat Apr 07 14:55:35 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@onelist.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_1_1); 7 Apr 2001 21:55:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 54115 invoked from network); 7 Apr 2001 21:55:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.142) by l7.egroups.com with QMQP; 7 Apr 2001 21:55:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.75) by mta3 with SMTP; 7 Apr 2001 22:56:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 7 Apr 2001 14:55:33 -0700 Received: from 200.41.210.8 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 07 Apr 2001 21:55:33 GMT X-Originating-IP: [200.41.210.8] To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Not because Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2001 21:55:33 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Apr 2001 21:55:33.0750 (UTC) FILETIME=[78742960:01C0BFAD] From: "Jorge Llambias" la lojbab cusku di'e >You thus can use ki'u lenu (they love firecrackers) kei ki'unai lenu (they >are not Americans). I agree. >Or join the second clause with ijeki'unai which makes it more clear that >they are not Americans because of the ije But this one doesn't work so well, because you'd be saying that the ki'unai clause applies to the whole previous sentence, ki'u included, and that is not the wanted meaning. What would be the selbri corresponding to ki'unai the way that krinu corresponds to ki'u? It is not nalki'u, but it seems that tolki'u could work: tolki'u: x1 is no obstacle for/does not prevent x2. x2 happens in spite of/even though x1. > >The Vietnamese get into the Fourth of July celebrations because they >enjoy > >firecrackers, not because they live below me. > >Since the second clause is irrelevant, you can join it with .iju, making it >.ijuki'unai only if you want to show the parallel to the former. But then it is not asserted that they live below me. I think this one is just: le nu vy nelci lei tanfagri kei enai le nu vy xabju le cnita be mi cu krinu le nu vy salci le se detri be li vopi'eze co'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.