From pycyn@aol.com Wed Aug 08 12:57:50 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: Pycyn@aol.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_2_0); 8 Aug 2001 19:57:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 61697 invoked from network); 8 Aug 2001 19:56:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.142) by l10.egroups.com with QMQP; 8 Aug 2001 19:56:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3 with SMTP; 8 Aug 2001 19:56:35 -0000 Received: from Pycyn@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v31.9.) id r.88.a788f28 (4585) for ; Wed, 8 Aug 2001 15:56:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <88.a788f28.28a2f367@aol.com> Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 15:56:23 EDT Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Transliterations survey To: lojban@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_88.a788f28.28a2f367_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10531 From: pycyn@aol.com --part1_88.a788f28.28a2f367_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 8/7/2001 9:35:01 PM Central Daylight Time, a.rosta@ntlworld.com writes: > like /xirosima/ & /xukusima/ is consistent not > necessarily with a mapping between Lojban phonetics and Japanese > phonetics but with a mapping between Lojban phonology and > This seems the best solution and may even be a help for some of those cases where two languages compete to name a place: Lojban might provide a single item compatible with both. There are two problems, though: 1) can Lojban, with something like 25 phonemes aways provide a useful mapping of phonemes in other languages (English mildly, Georgian horrifically, Sanskrit somewhere in between)? 2) Yuen Ren Chao's second most famous paper -- after his scrambled egg recipe -- is "The Non-uniqueness of Phonemic Solutions" which demonstrates that there are at least half-a-dozen equally valid phenmeic systems for (in this case) his native brand of Chinese. Which system do we take as a meaningful one to match up with Lojban? (note: I like the /m/ for /n/, /n/ for /ng/ solution, but the vowels are still in turmooil in Lojban transcriptions). --part1_88.a788f28.28a2f367_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 8/7/2001 9:35:01 PM Central Daylight Time,
a.rosta@ntlworld.com writes:


like /xirosima/ & /xukusima/ is consistent not
necessarily with a mapping between Lojban phonetics and Japanese
phonetics but with a mapping between Lojban phonology and
Japanese phonology.

This seems the best solution and may even be a help for some of those cases
where two languages compete to name a place: Lojban might provide a single
item compatible with both.  There are two problems, though:
1) can Lojban, with something like 25 phonemes aways provide a useful mapping
of phonemes in other languages (English mildly, Georgian horrifically,
Sanskrit somewhere in between)?
2) Yuen Ren Chao's second most famous paper -- after his scrambled egg recipe
-- is  "The Non-uniqueness of Phonemic Solutions" which demonstrates that
there are at least half-a-dozen equally valid phenmeic systems for (in this
case) his native brand of Chinese.  Which system do we take as a meaningful
one to match up with Lojban? (note: I like the /m/ for /n/, /n/ for /ng/
solution, but the vowels are still in turmooil in Lojban transcriptions).  
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