From a.rosta@dtn.ntl.com Fri Aug 17 20:27:46 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: a.rosta@dtn.ntl.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_3_1); 18 Aug 2001 03:27:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 14979 invoked from network); 18 Aug 2001 03:27:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.142) by l8.egroups.com with QMQP; 18 Aug 2001 03:27:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mta02-svc.ntlworld.com) (62.253.162.42) by mta3 with SMTP; 18 Aug 2001 03:27:44 -0000 Received: from andrew ([62.255.40.23]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.00 201-229-121) with SMTP id <20010818032742.KGSH29790.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@andrew> for ; Sat, 18 Aug 2001 04:27:42 +0100 Reply-To: To: Subject: RE: [lojban] ma smuni zo senva Date: Sat, 18 Aug 2001 04:24:33 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <4.3.2.7.2.20010816004708.00cfaea0@pop.cais.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "And Rosta" Lojbab: > At 09:46 PM 8/15/01 -0600, Jay Kominek wrote: > >IMO, day dreams, nightmares, good dreams are all cases of senva. Hoping > >that you get into graduate school isn't senva. Sitting around in class and > >thinking about how neat it would be to be to have a graduate degree, such > >that you're unaware of the professor lecturing, is senva. > > > >However, I would form some sort lujvo for all of them, and use the > >appropriate lujvo instead of senva directly, as it seems to be a gismu > >which is fairly vague and best left to lujvo/tanru construction. > > Note that this is precisely the opposite philosophy that Colin Fine once > expressed which was to Lojbanically use the broad if more vague term where > possible. He noted that English speakers are prone to being overspecific > about some things that are obvious, and that Lojban seems to make a bit of > art of being creatively vague or elliptical in leaving out things English > finds essential (like tense and number). Furthermore, tanru and lujvo are easier to interpret if they function to restrict and narrow the meaning of the head ("an X sort of Y; a Y that is X"). It's easier to narrow broad meanings than to broaden narrow meanings. (a cowandictum: "Blessed are the CHEESEMAKERS??" "--It's figurative; he's obviously referring to any manufacturer of dairy products.") --And.