From: Philip Newton <philip.newton@gmail.com>
Reply-To: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org
To: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: grasping lojban
Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 10:11:04 +0100
On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:40:02 -0600, Bob A <bob-a@houston.rr.com> wrote:
> coi; Im new to lojban, so I have some questions.
>
> I heard that lojban can use SOV order without any particles, so how can
> you interpret "mi klama zdani" as "I go to a home" and not "I am a home
> of something that goes"?
You cannot. However, {mi do tavla} would mean "I talk to you" and you
do not need other particles.
The difference being the word class: {do} is a cmavo while {klama} is
a brivla. Since putting two brivla together results in a tanru, you
need an explicit {cu} if the second brivla is the predicate. (Also,
you'd need an article: {mi le klama cu zdani} would be something like
"I am a home for something that goes" while *{mi klama cu zdani} would
be ungrammatical since {mi klama} is "I go" and then you get a {cu}
which introduces a predicate into a statement that already has one.)
Also, SOV is not really a good term for Lojban, since "subject" and
"object" are not necessarily descriptions for brivla which can have
more than two arguments.
> How do you form adjectives?
brivla can be nouns, adjectives, adverbs, or verbs depending on how
they are used:
{mi viska le blanu} = I see the blue thing (blanu = noun)
{mi viska le blanu dinju} = I see the blue building (blanu = adjective)
{mi blanu viska} = I bluely see (blanu = adverb)
{mi blanu} = I am blue (blanu = verb)
Note that "=" is used here not as "is" but more in the sense of "acts
in this sentence in a manner which would be filled by a
[noun/adjective/adverb/verb] in a corresponding English sentence".
> How do you include the objects of nouns?
I'm not sure what you mean here. What's the object of a noun?
> How can you tell when a compound phrase arnt just two words in different
> positions?
The simple answer is that if two words next to each other could be
considered together, they are; if you want the other interpretation,
you have to split them up, typically by inserting a suitable
terminator to the first portion.
For example, if you want to say *{mi le dinju viska} for "I see the
building", you could introduce the predicate by {cu} as {mi le dinju
cu viska} or terminate the sumti {le dinju} with the elidable
terminator {ku} -- with {le dinju ku}, the sentence becomes {mi le
dinju ku viska}, which is also correct. (The fullest form would be {mi
le dinju ku cu viska vau}.)
> How do you form adverbs?
Generally, brivla can work as adverbs if they modify a following
brivla which acts as a verb.
> How do you specify the degree of a word?
What do you mean by this?
> How do you talk about things like ownership and belongingship?
The things that come to my mind include the gismu {ponse} and the
cmavo {pe} and {po}.
For example, {mi ponse lo cukta} is "I have books"; {le cukta pe mi}
is "the book associated with me (e.g. the one next to me)" while {le
cukta po mi} is (roughly) "the book possessed by me".
> Which mailinglist is good for newbies to practise lojban?
This one is probably the best there is, though it's not very high-traffic
IME.
mu'o mi'e .filip.
--
Philip Newton <philip.newton@gmail.com>