[lojban-beginners] Re: la umpti.dumptis.

[Robin Lee Powell <rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org>]

On Thu, Jan 13, 2005 at 09:10:50PM +0000, Jon Reeves wrote:
> Robin Lee Powell wrote:
> 
> >>la umpti.dumptis. zutse lo bitmu
> >Humty Dumty sits on a wall
> 
> >>i. la umpti.dumptis. barda farlu
> >Humty Dumty bigly fell (I'd use clani farlu or ralju farlu)
> 
> a long fall sounds better than a big fall in english (despite the
> original being "Humpty Dumpty had a big fall"), however looking up
> the definitions they are extremely similar:
> 
> clani       cla      
> long                                      
>  x1 is long in dimension/direction x2 (default longest dimension) by 
>  measurement standard x3 
>
> barda       bra      
> big                   'large'             
>  x1 is big/large in property/dimension(s) x2 (ka) as compared with 
>  standard/norm x3  
>
> Seems that the difference is that clani is more about a measured
> dimension of a physical object, whereas barda is more about
> describing things (not necessarily objects -
> 'property/dimension(s)' ) that are relatively large, so i think
> perhaps barda is the better choice for this?

In the clani case, you are measuring lo ni clani.  Regardless, the
*right* word is jursa, which I didn't know about at the time.

> Not sure about the zi'e ? "joins relative clauses which apply to
> the same sumti" ? Wouldnt you need something like poi as a
> restrictive clause in there so that you are only talking about all
> the horses and all the men _which_ are alienable possessions of
> the king

po == poi steci srana, more or less.

> Also, I thought the loi should be included to indicate that it is
> the mass of men and horses that are incapable of putting him
> together again, rather than each of them individually being unable
> to do so

That's a good point.

> loi ro xirma .e ro prenu poi po le nolraitru

No.  The loi only binds with "ro xirma", "poi po" is illegal, and in
any case the poi would only bind with "ro prenu" (which is what the
zi'e is for).

The loi version is:

loi ro xirma .e loi ro prenu zi'e po le nolraitru

> Thanks for the input, I've been trying to learn Lojban for ages
> and i've just got to the point where i can start writing stuff
> that is understandable - even if not quite what i meant

Coolness.  Keep it up!

-Robin

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