[lojban-beginners] Re: {nu penmi} versus {le nunpenmi}

[Robin Lee Powell <rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org>]

On Wed, Mar 02, 2005 at 03:31:26PM -0500, Matt Arnold wrote:
> Robin,
>
> What are the differences in usage and purpose between saying
> "meeting" as {le nu penmi}, and "meeting" as {le nunpenmi}? 

Well, technically "nunpenmi", being a lujvo, can mean whatever the
creator wants it to mean and have a really bizarre place structure
and so on.

In practice, however, NU + selbri == nunselbri is used to drop a
level of nesting.  Example:

mi klama lo nu penmi lo nu gunka

"I go to the meeting from the working".  This is actually wrong,
however, because "lo nu" introduces a level of nesting which must be
closed by kei or vau:

mi klama lo nu penmi kei lo nu gunka

Or you can lose a bunch of syllables by:

mi klama lo nunpenmi lo nu gunka

For reasons that I'm not clear on, the construction like this that
has been used the most often IME is nunpenmi.  Odd, but there you
are.

> The same question applies not only to abstractors but to
> applications of {se}, {te}, {ve} etc. which I've seen incorporated
> into compound words as well. 

There are different reasons to do that.  Generally, SE + brivla ==
selbrivla is only used seriously when the x2 place has an obvious
natlang keyword and you want to stick it in a dictionary; so
"selkla" is useful because English (at least; I assume there are
many others) has a word for "destination", so often English speakers
want a single word for same.

In more complicated lujvo, its effects are somewhat different, but
that gets pretty intense.  I can expand on it if you want.

> The first time I came across it a few years ago I was surprised
> because I thought only rafsi were used in compound words. 

They are; some cmavo have rafsi.  97 of them, in fact.

-Robin

-- 
http://www.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/ *** http://www.lojban.org/
Reason #237 To Learn Lojban: "Homonyms: Their Grate!"
Proud Supporter of the Singularity Institute - http://singinst.org/