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[lojban] Re: Regarding the gismu {vlagi}.
Lindar Greenwood wrote:
Hello there. I'm sending this to the mailing list (of which I do not believe I am a member, but I think I'll subscribe) and to Lojban general inquiries.
Please follow me for a moment.
{pinji} is either a clitoris or penis, as both are homologous.
{ganti} is either the testes or ovaries, as both are homologous.
The definition for the latter is not so human-centric. We didn't
include English words for non-human analogues for pinji because I don't
know any. The same caveat applies to the words following - there is
more than simple male-human/female-human homology intended.
The intent was to cover as much of biological and sexual terminology
word-space as possible with as few words as possible, but necessarily
limited to the knowledge of educated English speakers with a selection
of foreign language dictionaries at hand.
{vibna} is the vagina, for which there isn't a male equivalent.
not in humans. The definition should probably have been written to
explicit include non-human analogues, but again I don't know any words
for same, and it probably depends on how one forms the analogy, exactly
what should be included.
I recall that we debated adding a separate word for cervix as well, but
I think we decided that a tanru could satisfy the need - I'm not all
that sure myself of the biological distinction.
{plibu} is the external genitalia (which is 'vulva' in English for the female parts, and for which there is no male-equivalent).
The vulva is only part of the female external genitalia. Pudenda is the
closer English language term for the human external genitalia, and can
be used for both genders, but usually is used only for the female parts.
{vlagi} is the female external genitalia.
It is *part* of the human female external genitalia, and possibly with
analogues in other species - again something I pretend no expertise in.
Whether there is a male analogue, I will leave for someone else to
decide. Perhaps the foreskin could be expressed as nakvlagi. So far as
I know, no Lojbanist has coined another word for it.
We considered expressing vlagi as a tanru using ctebi. But we were too
unsure that this wasn't a malglico metaphor.
To specify male vs. female of these (excepting vibna unless we're making a joke), we append {nak-} for male and {fet-} for female.
That sort of thing was indeed the intent. At the time, the more
versatile the potential metaphorical usage, the better.
So, isn't {vlagi} just taking up space when we could just as easily use {fetplibu} and use {vlagi} for something else?
The use seems extremely redundant, and I would love to know the opinions of the Lojban community (and officials) on this matter.
The goal was to make sure that we had sufficient gismu to cover the
commonly referred to words for body parts, for which of course only the
sexual organs are differentiated between males and females, though
other body parts have species analogues. I deferred considerably to my
wife for perspective on which body parts rated gismu, and in this arena
erred on the side of too many rather than too few, because sex-talk is
rather too taboo in English (and probably in other languages) for
someone not explicitly studying the subject linguistically to give an
unbiased opinion.
lojbab
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