Re: [lojban] Re: camxes's reaction to some fu'ivla

[Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu>]

On Monday 25 January 2010 08:46:54 Jorge Llambías wrote:
> We should probably make a list of outstanding issues. The ones that
> come to mind are:

Can you give examples of words affected by these issues? Preferably meaningful 
or found in the Book.

> (1) Syllable onsets:
>
> (a) Is the empty onset allowed or not? This affects vowel clusters
> such as "oa", "aa", etc. in fu'ivla, which require an empty onset for
> the second vowel.

I think it should be. The example "bangrkorea" is in the refgram.

> (b) Are Ci/Cu onsets permitted in fu'ivla? Are CCi/CCu onsets
> permitted? Are CCCi/CCCu onsets permitted? Are 'i/'u onsets permitted?
>
> (c) Can i/u be onsets if the nucleus is a diphthong? (a.k.a. are
> triphthongs allowed?)

There's one occurrence of a triphthong in the refgram, but no list of valid 
triphthongs.

> (2) Syllable codas:  how many consonants are allowed in a syllable
> coda? If more than one, are there any special restrictions?

I think it should be two, with the restriction that if there are two, the 
first has to be in the set {r,n,l,m}. My made-up example is "tarksako"; the 
one in the Book is "bongnanba". If "tarksako" is disallowed, I could go 
with "traksako" or "tarsako" (or "cinfydenspa").

I tried various versions of these and could not figure out what rule camxes is 
using. It allows "tarkmako" but not "tarksako", even though both "ks" 
and "km" are allowed medially but not initially. Similarly "bongnanba" but 
not "bongbanba".

> (3) Syllable nuclei: (I don't think there are any issues here.)
>
> (4) cmevla: Are the constraints for cmevla less strict than for
> fu'ivla (the ones mentioned above in particular.)

I think that a cmevla should be allowed to end with any consonant cluster that 
is permitted medially in a brivla.

> Anything else?

damskrima: vlatai rejects this, both camxes and valfendi allow it.
Max length of consonant clusters. It is possible to make an infinitely long 
string of consonants, all pairs of which are initial, such as "ststst...".

What should be counted as a cmavo for purposes of falling off the head of a 
brivla? I consider it to be any sequence consisting of at least one vowel, 
possibly with apostrophes between vowels, and possibly preceded by a 
consonant. Thus "tioprano" breaks up, even though there is no actual 
cmavo "tio".

Pierre

-- 
I believe in Yellow when I'm in Sweden and in Black when I'm in Wales.