Re: [lojban] Response to Robin's "Essay on the future of Lojban"

[Stela Selckiku <selckiku@gmail.com>]

On Sat, Apr 10, 2010 at 3:37 AM, Bob LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org> wrote:
>
> On the other hand, Nora just said something that I think profoundly reflects
> my misgivings.  She's tried (far more than I have) to understand xorlo, but
> she just can't get her mind around it.  That makes her feel incompetent at
> the language, which is the strongest demotivater for actually using it, much
> less doing byfy work.


I agree that this can only be a sign that you've thought about it too
hard.  Under xorlo (which is the same as saying, with apologies to any
holdbacks, under modern Lojban) the meaning of the article "lo" (which
is the only one you need to learn to use) is simply "lo broda = zo'e
noi ke'a broda".  In other words it's simply something that is an x1
of broda.  Nothing more is specified.


> There seems to be a group of relative newcomers that would be happy to copy
> and/or paraphrase the CLL materials (which are now online, right?) and the
> cmavo list, on each cmavo onto the web page definitions.  That is the most
> basic step.  Some can comb through the wiki and even the lojban list
> archives and find where people have raised issues about that cmavo.   I
> think that treating the problem more like contributing to a wiki page on
> each individual word will get us pretty close to a description of the status
> quo without any actual decisions needing to be made.


A wiki page on each individual word!  That.  That is what I want.  A
wiki is only one option, of course, but some sort of open forum
dedicated to each word.  I would prefer to see it as a new, separate
project, clean, specific.  (I suggest the name za'e "vlasnu".)  I
could maybe be convinced that it could be hosted on the tiki or in
jbovlaste entry discussions, but so far it's seemed to me like the
organization and structure and vibe of those places isn't conducive to
the conversation I'd like to see.

Most importantly I'd like to encourage questions from new students
about particular words to be asked and answered in that forum.  We've
discussed most of the words in Lojban repeatedly, in depth, but we've
lost those conversations to a lack of organization.

I would also volunteer to go around myself writing a few informal
paragraphs about my understanding of the meaning (and history!) of
various words.  My perspective on it is: I'm glad to talk informally
in English about what I think the words mean, or attempt to specify
them carefully in Lojban, but having to try to craft a brief yet
unambiguous English definition, well, that's just the sort of thing I
came to Lojban to avoid. :P  Not that I don't think that's work worth
doing, but I'm not the person to do it, as I can't get my head around
it.


> And the silent majority is still silent; many of them are like Nora,
> and unable to keep up with the traffic.


Would you please ask Nora, and anyone else without the time to follow
our main forums, if they would please consider tuning into Lojbanistan
some other way?

For instance one option is to glance sometimes at the front page of
Jbotcan: http://jbotcan.org/jbo  It's been quiet lately, but that
means it's very easy to keep up with, and even if it were to get busy
you wouldn't have to catch everything that goes by in order to enjoy
it.  It's a great place to pick up vocabulary!


> One hopes that, post-baseline, there will be others who will be willing and
> qualified.  But I'm willing to risk it being you-and-xorxes if absolutely
> necessary.


mi ji'a pu'i kakne

mi'e la stela selckiku
mu'o

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