Re: [lojban] non-clausal ke'a

[Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu>]

On Saturday 20 November 2010 08:44:23 tijlan wrote:
> What could this mean:
>
> [.i] mi ke'a citka

It's syntactically valid, but it's nonsense, just like "du ra'o", "te.u", 
and "pe naku". It's like saying "Which I eat.", except that "which" 
corresponds to "poi ... ke'a" together. (Hebrew and Modern Greek have a word 
like "poi", but no special pronoun like "ke'a".)

> I'm asking this as I've been thinking about the difference between
> "le/la/les" and "en" in French:
>
> Je vois une pomme. Je la mange.
> (I see an apple. I eat it.)
> mi viska pa plise .i mi ri citka
>
> Je vois des pommes. Je les mange.
> (I see apples. I eat them.)
> mi viska su'o plise .i mi ri citka
>
> Je vois des pommes. J'en mange.
> (I see apples. I eat "of them".)
> mi viska su'o plise .i mi ___ citka
>
> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/en#French
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_personal_pronouns#The_pronoun_en
>
> Would {ri/ra/ru} alone be an accurate translation of "en", which
> differs from "le/la/les" in the referent's quantity (i.e. whereas "Je
> la mange." means that the whole of the object is eaten, "J'en mange."
> doesn't imply such an entirety)? My guess is that {su'o ri}, that is
> {su'o su'o plise}, would be more accurate than a bare {ri}. But I also
> vaguely feel that "en" might have something to do more with
> relativising "ke'a" than with back-counting "ri/ra/ru" (or the lerfu
> solution, for that matter -- "py" in this case).

I'd say "mi su'o ri citka", but this pronoun is peculiar to French, Occitan (I 
think), and Catalan and is bound to cause some trouble in translating.

Pierre
-- 
When a barnacle settles down, its brain disintegrates.
Já não percebe nada, já não percebe nada.

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