Re: [lojban] xorlo and masses

[John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>]

If by plural predication (which seems an odd term, but no worse than usual in 
Logjam) you mean that terms may have multiple referents (that reference is a 
relation, not a function) and quantified variables may have several simultaneous 
instantiations, then xorlo has (finally, a couple of years ago) plural 
predication.  This is a change from the long history of Logjam, where we had 
(officially, but we behaved as though it wasn't there) singular predication with 
C-sets doing the work of pluralities.  Now, it turns out that the logic of 
plural reference (a better term, if we are talking about the same thing) is 
exactly the same as that for L-sets (which were around all the time but we never 
had the insight to use them), so some few of us too highly indoctrinated 
logicians tend to continue to use the L-set language or something equivalent to 
it, even when we know we are just talking about things.So, the answer is (i), 
but some still talk as though the answer is (iii), not that it makes any 
difference in practice.




----- Original Message ----
From: Martin Bays <mbays@sdf.org>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wed, August 17, 2011 6:46:34 AM
Subject: Re: [lojban] xorlo and masses

* Tuesday, 2011-08-16 at 09:11 -0700 - John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>:

> [snip useful analysis]
>
> Now, can we get back to the issue, whatever it was?  Or has it been
> resolved by careful sorting out?

My original question, which I'm afraid did develop into a tangled mess
of confusion though I had specifically hoped it wouldn't, was in short
whether (i) post-xorlo Lojban has plural predication, or (ii) whether it
just emulates plural predication by using groups-as-individuals, or
(iii) both. I wasn't expecting (iii) to be the answer, but it seems it
is.

So yes, basically resolved - my thanks for your involvement in which -
modulo details of precisely how plural predication works, and how it
interacts with groups-as-individuals.

Martin

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