Re: [lojban] {.au}/{djica}={.ai}/{?}. No gismu for intention

[Jorge Llambías <jjllambias@gmail.com>]

On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 11:32 PM, Mike S. <maikxlx@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 11, 2012 at 6:52 PM, Jorge Llambías <jjllambias@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> Similarly for other attitudinals, "ui" is similar to "ca'e mi
>> jarco lo nu mi gleki", "I hereby display my happiness", and so on.
>
> I would think that ".ui" simply means "I am happy", not "I display my
> happiness".

"I _hereby_ express my happiness", i.e. "by performing this very
speech act, I am expressing my happiness".

> Either way, if the speaker is actually unhappy, I think that we
> have to admit that he is being disingenuous to his audience if he utters
> ".ui" with no hint of irony.

Certainly.

> Because of this, I think these attitudinals
> are as truth-functional as any brivla: they evaluate to a real truth value
> given two arguments: the speaker and the proposition that the attitudinal is
> embedded in. Obviously it's hard to know if a person is truthful in the
> expression of his own feelings, but there are sometimes signs, and the truth
> value of such expressions are still there, however hidden.

It doesn't make a whole lot of difference whether we want to call them
true/false, honest/dishonest, genuine/fake, felicitous/infelicitous or
whatever. The point of avoiding true/false is that for example you
can't use "na" to convert a fake "ui" into a genuine one, like you can
use it to convert a false statement into a true one, and the same
applies to other truth functional operators like logical connectives.
It does make sense to distinguish between the truth value of a
proposition and the genuinity? genuiness? of an expression.

> Even more so in the case with the irrealis attitudinals.  If I say ".ai [I
> am giving you a million bucks tomorrow]" when I know that I am bankrupt and
> all my banking accounts are overdrawn then clearly I am lying to you.  ".ai
> mi dunda la lunra do" is simply (literally) false when uttered by any
> non-delusional interlocutor.

lie
noun
1.
a false statement made with deliberate intent to deceive; an
intentional untruth; a falsehood.
2.
something intended or serving to convey a false impression; imposture:

A fake expression of intention can certainly count as a lie in sense 2.

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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