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Re: [lojban] "He didn't start to paint until he was thirty"

Am 17.10.2012 11:06, schrieb Escape Landsome:

Today I scrutinize the following sentence in Japanese :

彼は３０歳になってから絵をかき始めた。
He didn't start to paint until he was thirty.

Strictly speaking, the translation ought to be : "He BEGAN painting at 30".

But they say in english : "He DIDN'T START... UNTIL".

Now, I find this a little confusing.   Not starting to do something
has nothing to do with beginning, even "UNTIL".

How do Lojban handle this kind of thing ?


You can do both in Lojban:

   co'a pirfi'i ca lo nu nanca li cino
   He began painting when he was thirty.

(which is the same as:)

   pirfi'i co'a lo nu nanca li cino
The other one needs to be treated with some care, or you'll get the wrong negation-scope: 

   co'u lo nu nanca li cino cu na pirfi'i
   Until he was thirty, he didn't paint.
   Him not painting ended when he was thirty.

Or if you want an afterthought co'u:

   na pirfi'i .i co'u bo nanca li cino
   He didn't paint, until he was thirty.


Placing na in front of the co'u wouldn't work:

   na pirfi'i co'u tu'a li cino
   It is not the case that he stopped painting at thirty.

So you have to either place co'u in the front, or split the sentences.

mu'o mi'e la selpa'i

--
pilno zo le xu .i lo dei bangu cu se cmene zo lojbo .e nai zo lejbo

doị mèlbi mlenì'u
   .i do càtlu ki'u
ma fe la xàmpre ŭu
   .i do tìnsa càrmi
gi'e sìrji se tàrmi
   .i taị bo pu cìtka lo gràna ku


.

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