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Re: [lojban] Someone please explain {xrani} to me.




On Wed, Jul 10, 2013 at 8:51 AM, Robert LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org> wrote:

 Perhaps the x3 might refer more specifically to the skin integrity, which is clearly a property.
[...]
But if the resulting state is death, the x3 might be the specific cause of death.  Concussion, stroke, pain, are all possible x4 injuries that could result from different x3 property injuries.

In medical contexts, it becomes more clear how to use both. x4 would be used to express the symptoms, whereas x3 would express the damage causing the symptoms.  "head trauma", an x3, might result in a variety of x4 states (concussion, coma, paralysis).

"Head trauma" and "skin integrity" don't seem to be both possible for x3.  I think "skin integrity" is right and "head trauma" wrong.

I think we can read "xrani" as "x1 causes x2 to stop having desirable property x3 and start having undesirable property x4".  So in Robin's example, x3 could be the skin integrity and x4 the having a scraped knee. 

The second reading, where x3 could be a head trauma, would be something like "x1 causes x2 to have undesirable property x3, which in turn results in having property x4", but I can't get that reading from the definition of "xrani". x3 is the property that gets injured/damaged/destroyed, the property that exists before the injury takes place, not the property resulting from the injury. 

mu'o mi'e xorxes

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