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Re: [lojban] [oz] {ze'a lo nu ko'a jmive}




On 14 February 2014 17:38, Michael Turniansky <mturniansky@gmail.com> wrote:
  Two points.  First, why does "lo nu ko'a jmive" have to refer to an entire lifespan?  Am I not living between 10 AM and 11AM this morning?  Is that span not a "nu ko'a jmive"? (It seems you would be happier if there were a "pi so'e" before the "lo nu..." )


As I said, making {nunji'e} distributive in this manner makes {ze'a lo nu ko'a jmive} give not enough information in the particular context. Under this interpretation, the Tin Woodman could, for example, have abandoned his elderly mother the day after his father's death and still be said to have taken care of her during "lo nu lo mamta cu jmive". In fact, this interpretation makes {ze'a lo nu ko'a jmive} pretty much equivalent to {ca lo nu ko'a jmive}.

Portion-quantifying the _expression_ still misses the point. It doesn't matter how much of the lifetime is involved. In fact, the widowhood and the fighting are probably much less than half of the corresponding lifetimes.


  Second, oddly enough, it happens to agree with my own (admittedly, non-CLL-standard) interpretation of ZEhA/VEhA+SUMTI, namely that it "ze'i ko'a" means "during a small portion of ko'a"; "ze'a ko'a" "about half the duration of ko'a"; "ze'u ko'a", "during most of ko'a", and "ze'e ko'a", "during all of ko'a".  My argument for these are that otherwise ZEhA+SUMTI doesn't make things relative to the sumti, in an analogous manner as PU+SUMTI,  FAhA+SUMTI, BAI+SUMTI etc do (and, I would argue, as should VA/ZI+SUMTI).  Otherwise what's the point of having four different versions when they would all mean the same length of time/distance?)


Interesting. I will consider this!

In any case, your interpretation doesn't save the particular examples I gave. As I argued above, they would be true, but miss the point.


  (I know the arguments against this interpretation, but just throwing it out there).


The idea is new to me. If someone could quickly sketch or point the arguments, I would be grateful.

mu'o
mi'e .asiz.

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