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Re: [lojban] la .alis.
Sorry about the typo (more eyesight problems); I did mean '.' (careful check).
What I was suggesting about 'la' and 'lo' was that, for names which are Lojban predicates, introduce with 'lo' and shift immediately to 'la'. The capitalization is up for grabs, though I see no harm in following Dodgson here in capitalizing a common noun.
Is it true that 'blabi ractu' etc. have no required pause? I would think that was where those pauses (which are largely superfluous) would actually be necessary -- to keep the name from fading into the predicate (but I suppose 'cu' is required in any case).
----- Original Message ----
From: Jorge Llambías <jjllambias@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wed, March 31, 2010 9:05:34 AM
Subject: Re: [lojban] la .alis.
On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Michael Everson
<michael.everson@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 30 Mar 2010, at 21:06, John E Clifford wrote:
>
>> 2. Unless things have changed a lot, the occurrence of ',' is almost always predictable. The use in texts was originally an aid to learning, to remind people to take a breath (or break). Somehow, it stuck and is now being touted as "standard orthography". Are the only pictures allowed in Lojban books to be those of Dick, Jane, Spot, and Fluffy?
>
> In this text the only occurrence of comma is in the name "la meri,An". I wonder of "la Meri An" is sufficient, unless stress must be marked as "la Meri Án".
I suspect John's ',' was a typo for '.'. The occurence of the period
is the one that is fully predictable, the occurrence of the comma is
fully unpredictable, and has no phonemic significance (indeed it is
not even clear why the comma is part of the alphabet at all, since it
doesn't represent any phoneme). Also, it is the period, not the comma
that serves "to remind people to take a breath (or break)", the comma
serves to remind NOT to take a breath or break, even though there is a
syllable boundary.
"la Meri An" doesn't work, because "meri" is the cmavo string "me ri",
not a cmevla.
I would suggest "la merián" or "la Merián", or if three syllables is a
must, then "la meriián" or "la Meriián".
>> But there are some places where a pause is not so obvious, mainly IIRC at the ends of names. To be sure, if the name is capitalized, then this is predictable as well, even if the name is a purely Lojban phrase. In short, a dotless text would be quite adequate and much nicer looking.
The pause after cmevla is fully predictable, as they are the only
words that end in a consonant.
Names that do not use cmevla do not require a pause.
>> 3. As for capitalizing words that are not cmene but Lojban phrases, the easiest generally satisfactory way would seem to be to convert all the 'lo's (but surely they all should have been 'le's) to 'la's.
>
> This does seem to be satisfactory, if the grammar allows it.
As I said, using "la" for:
...when suddenly a White Rabbit with pink eyes ran close by her...
is at the very least semantically odd. (Syntactically, it is fine.)
mu'o mi'e xorxes
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