Re: [lojban] Lojban wall of complexity (beginner thoughts)

[Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu>]

On Tuesday 24 July 2012 17:58:04 Bruno Durin wrote:
> Coi rodo
>
> I am a beginner and I am trying to summarize some thoughts and ideas about
> my experience of my first steps in Lojban. So please bear in mind that part
> of, or maybe all, of what I am saying may be moot because it's only the
> reflect of my low level in Lojban. Please note also that English is not my
> mother tongue (I'm French). I also send this message on this mailing list
> because to my mind it falls in a broader scope that just beginner
> questions.

There is a lojban-fr mailing list you may be interested in. There's also a 
recording somewhere of several of us at last year's jbonunsla singing "ni'o 
le bi'u cmalu bloti ze'epu naku xe klama". We weren't sure what to do 
with "Ohé matelot navigue sur les flots", though.

> So let's imagine I would like to translate the following small text on
> classes to describe what is object programming (this is a very bad
> description, but anyway)
> "Classes are composed of members and methods. Two classes can be linked by
> an inheritance relationship. A class has a constructor, whose role is to
> initialize an instance of the class and a destructor, whose role is clean
> the instance before memory desallocation."
> So how do I decide which part of Lojban to use? Cmavo like "I define", "I
> state", etc.? Or should I look for gismo that express the relationship
> (something like: "members" pagbu "class" .i "methods" pagbu "class")? Or
> use set constructs with "du" or "mintu" and mex to express the fact that
> class = set {members, methods} which could also be a valid way to define
> class at the level of details of my silly example? To which extend should I
> translate computer science words? Use standard morphology as for
> "spaghetti" translation to Lojban? Use "klesi" for class or "le'a" to
> express category? etc. At this stage it seems to me that it's not only a
> question of my better learning Lojban, it's also a question of building new
> vocabulary, of knowing how to choose a construct rather than another
> (finding the right style in Lojban to write about a given field --here it's
> computer science--, as there is a specific style to follow when writing
> mathematics (theorems for example) in English), of understanding thoroughly
> Lojban design not to spoil it (for example by using systematically mex
> constructs to write formal definitions that have nothing to do with
> mathematics, as I could do with "class = set {members, methods}"). To what
> extend do you have to be a linguist and/or a major contributor of Lojban
> (who I am not, not even a computer scientist) to achieve this goal? Do I
> have to wait for Lojban texts on computer science (or juridic texts, which
> is another area where I find Lojban very interesting) to be written before
> writing some myself or am I able to contribute?

This computer-science term "class" is definitely not "klesi". A possible word 
for the concept is "gaurtarmi", "a form of instances that do things". Methods 
and members could be then gaurpau fa'u cadypau. "lo gaurtarmi cu cerda fi lo 
drata gaurtarmi" sounds fine to me. You can indicate a definition 
with "ca'edai" (it's a definition, but I didn't define it).

Pierre
-- 
Jews use a lunisolar calendar; Muslims use a solely lunar calendar.

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