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Re: [lojban] baby words, sort of: catlu vs. zgana



Actually, those two examples don't relate as much as you'd like. Vision occurs when light reflects off an object into the eye, and is afterward processed by the brain (the brain does *a lot* of work to see). "Seeing events" doesn't make much sense, because sight is just a primitive based on capturing light. You see the object regardless of its state.

As for desire, this can only apply to states. Wanting an apple doesn't really mean *anything*. Seeing an apple does.

.i mi'e la tsani mu'o

On 13 September 2012 14:32, la gleki <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:


On Thursday, September 13, 2012 8:07:23 PM UTC+4, stevo wrote:


On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 10:17 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:



When we say "I see you" we actually mean "I see you standing/present in front of me/{co'e}/whatever".

I don't understand why you think "I see you" is short for a longer phrase, especially one that is too specific and often simply not true. 

I just think the sentence "I want [to eat] an apple" is somewhat parallel to "I see you [standing]". If in the first one we must use {tu'a} then the same should be true for the second sentence.

stevo

So {mi viska do} is just a handy emulation of natlangs when it should really be expressed as {mi viska tu'a do}. But as some lojbanists already do this illegal trick then let's make it official.

Therefore 
{mi ganse lo du'u crino} - I sense something as being green (i.e. I see it).
{mi ganse lo du'u lo cladu ku crino} -  I sense some loud object as green (i.e. I see it)
{mi ganse [tu'a] lo cladu}   - I sense some loud object [nothing is said how I sense it, it's might be a synonym of the previous example].

So there is no conflict between the object and the type of sensing it. In first case you use {tu'a} or just drop it. In the second case you use {lo su'u/nu/du'u/...}



We have no gismu for TASTE ( {vrusi} has no place for experiencer) and TOUCH-FEEL ({pencu} is now what we need. when i touch {ko'a} with a screwdriver i touch-feel the screwdriver but touch {ko'a} ).
We would also need to allow in {sumne2} not only the object being smelled but the type of smell and abstraction for the combination of the object and it's smell.
 



 

On Sunday, July 15, 2012 12:37:26 AM UTC+4, Robin Powell wrote:
On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 01:32:54PM -0700, djandus wrote:
> On Friday, November 18, 2011 3:48:51 PM UTC-6, xorxes wrote:
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 18, 2011 at 5:15 AM, Robin Lee Powell wrote:
> > > This is really interesting stuff!  Can you make sure it
> > > appears on some appropriate BPFK page?
> > >
> > > I completely agree with you about zgana, and I'm inclined to
> > > agree with you about ganse; make sure they get notes in the
> > > gismu setion please.
> >  
> > I'm not in much of a wiki-editing mood lately, so I'll leave
> > that to somepony else.
> >
> Dude, did this really never get done?

I linked to the thread on the gismu issues page, a few hours ago.

-Robin

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