[lojban] {le} in xorlo (was: Re: Response to Robin's "Essay on the future of Lojban"

[And Rosta <and.rosta@gmail.com>]

Stela Selckiku, On 12/04/2010 07:20:
> The distinction between lo/loi and le/lei is a separate and equally
> simple distinction.  In this case in the deep structure the meaning is
> accomplished by "skicu", describe.  So "le broda" transforms to "zo'e
> noi mi ke'a do skicu lo ka ce'u broda", something which I describe it
> to you as being broda.

After some googling I found <http://www.lojban.org/tiki/BPFK+Section:+gadri>, and while the informal definition of E gadri as specific is as expected, this formal definition seems erroneous, for two reasons. The first is that "zo'e noi mi ke'a do skicu lo ka ce'u broda" does not encode specificity (aka referentiality). The second is that the contents of the noi phrase fall within the truth-conditions of the containing bridi. You could probably argue that this is trivial, because "mi ke'a do skicu" is true by virtue of being uttered, so affects the truth-conditions vacuously, but that performativity is not encoded, so "mi ke'a do skicu" is not in fact true by virtue of being uttered, so is not truth-conditionally inert. I'd have thought the second problem could have been remedied by using "voi" rather than "noi", though I expect this must have been considered and rejected for some reason, and it still leaves the first problem.

I'm also wondering whether there exists an experimental specific KOhA, a nonanaphoric "it/them". (I think I used to use "le du" in lieu of such.) If there were, then E gadri could be defined as "zo'e'e voi ke'a broda", no? (where zo'e'e is the specific KOhA). (I don't see any such cmavo in <http://www.lojban.org/tiki/currently+proposed+experimental+cmavo>. But I did find there the brilliant UI "bua'a'a", 'Before I kill you I will explain my master plan'.)

--And.

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