On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 11:05 AM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:Whatever the reason, it was a good choice.
>
> Actually, being the primary (and practically only) editor of the list, it
> was I that originally went with "say". My reason for the choice at the time
> was length, as "say" is much shorter than "express", and at the time I was
> editing that particular definition my primary concern was the length
> thereof, and I wanted to be certain that the definition was not too long for
> Smart.fm's cards.
Good. Even better than the original, with the misleading "expresses".
> The orignal being:
> x1 (agent) expresses/says x2 (sedu'u/text/lu'e concept) for audience x3 via
> expressive medium x4
>
> was thus shortened to:
> x1 says x2 for audience x3 via medium x4
But it isn't a better word to use. I think you still don't understand
> It happens that "express" does not cause the definition to be too long, and
> coupled with the English-speakers tendency to asociate the word "say" with
> the meaning of {ba'usku}, I agreed with Robin that "express" would be a
> better word to use.
why I'm saying that "express" is a bad choice. If you have:
x1 expresses x2 to x3 via medium x4
and you don't already know what "cusku" actually means, you will end
up saying things like:
la djan cusku lo nu ri prami kei la meris lo nu dunda lo rozgu
John expresses his love to Mary by giving her a rose.
Do you see why that is wrong?
Do you see that "his love" is the kind
of argument that "express" wants, and not the kind of argument that
"cusku" or "say" want?
Yes, and so is "talk".
> The primary definitions of speak and talk are explicitly vocal, which is why
> "say" is associated with vocal communication.
"cusku" and "tavla" are also primarily but not exclusively associated
with vocal communication. Why is that a problem?
Just like "cusku" then.
> Although it is true that the
> word can and often is used in relation to non-verbal communication, it is
> through context that listeners know that "say" is not being used in it's
> default manner.
BTW, what replacement do you plan to use instead of "talk" for
"tavla", to avoid the association with vocal communication?
mu'o mi'e xorxes
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