Re: [lojban] Re: multilingual lovesong

[Matthew Walton <matthew@matthew-walton.co.uk>]

On 26 April 2011 08:27, nilcefas <nils.schaeffer@gmail.com> wrote:
> ok, now that sounds more profound, i guess. but i'm not sure, if i get
> it right:
>
> 1. what does {sagycku} in the first bridi mean? (where does the {cku}
> come from?) wouldn't {sanga} suffice?

I don't get that one either. Vlasisku thinks the second component of
that lujvo is {cukta}. If you expand into a tanru it doesn't make much
sense, although I suppose it could be a lujvo something like x1 sings
work/words x2 but I'm not sure it's actually necessary to do it that
way. Hopefully latros will clarify.

> 2. do you really mean the second selbri is {se zgitci}? or should it
> rather be {sance}? otherwise i don't get the meaning of it.

{se zgitci} is "x1 is sound produced by musical instrument x2", so the
{lo nu} part is about {ko'a} being produced by all musical instruments
{ro zgitci}. There doesn't seem to be anything in the dictionary
currently along the lines of "x1 plays musical instrument x2 producing
word/tune/notes/sound x3" but this seems like a good way to get that
idea across to me. Although it does leave out that the singer wants to
actually do the playing, so one might want something in there to do
with {gasnu} or more likely {gau}, but you're going to run out of
syllables probably. Although I think most people probably understand
that musical instruments don't tend to play themselves. Unless they're
MIDI-controlled and plugged into a sequencer.

{sance} is just "x1 is sound produced/emitted by x2", which leaves out
the idea that it's musical instruments which are being played which I
feel is quite important here. Both the German and the English are
fairly explicit about that in my mind (although my German is fairly
poor).

>
> On 25 Apr., 21:12, Ian Johnson <blindbrav...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> {goi} might actually be better than {po'u}, since ko'a is theretofore
>> unused.
>>
>> mu'o mi'e .latros.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Ian Johnson <blindbrav...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > .i mi djica lo nu sagycku ko'a do bau ro bangu .i go'i lo nu ko'a se zgitci
>> > ro zgitci .i ko'a po'u lu mi prami do .iu li'u
>>
>> > Something like that.
>>
>> > mu'o mi'e .latros.
>>
>> > On Mon, Apr 25, 2011 at 2:28 PM, nilcefas <nils.schaef...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>> >> right! {djica lo nu sanga} is obviously the better choice. would a
>> >> construction with {.au} work as well? like {mi .au sanga}?
>>
>> >> concerning the {da}: what i tried to do was a structure like this:
>>
>> >> "i want to sing X in every language, and make X sound on every
>> >> instrument. X = i love you"
>>
>> >> i was not sure whether {da} was the right cmavo to choose, but i
>> >> certainly don't mean {do}. wouldn't that mean like "i want to sing
>> >> <you> in every language"? i thought about using {go'o}, but that i'm
>> >> not sure about at all. actually, wouldn't that only work for the
>> >> second (the {sance})-bridi but not for the first one?
>>
>> >> On Apr 24, 10:53 pm, ".arpis." <rpglover64+jbo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> > A few comments:
>>
>> >> > {djica sanga} is "want type-of sing", which would be better used to mean
>> >> > something like "desirously sing"; {sanga djica} is probably better at
>> >> > expressing "want to sing", or an explicit {djica lo nu sanga}.
>> >> > I'm not sure why the {da} in the first bridi is there; should it be
>> >> {do}?
>> >> > And I'm not sure what the {da} in the second bridi is doing there
>> >> either.
>>
>> >> > As far as I can tell, the {iu} at the end is fine; it attaches to {do},
>> >> > which works perfectly in context.
>>
>> >> > On Sun, Apr 24, 2011 at 3:51 PM, nilcefas <nils.schaef...@gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> > > coi rodo
>>
>> >> > > lately, i have been to a performance by "bodo wartke", a german
>> >> "musik-
>> >> > > kabarettist". one of his pieces features a short love-poem, which he
>> >> > > translated into over eighty languages so far. these include conlangs
>> >> > > such as esperanto, quenya and klingon, but lojban is still missing. so
>> >> > > i made an effort to translate it with my rudimentary lojban-skills.
>> >> > > that's why i'd be glad if anyone could look through my translation...
>>
>> >> > > the german original goes as follows:
>>
>> >> > > >> ich will's in allen sprachen für dich singen, auf allen
>> >> instrumenten zum
>> >> > > erklingen bringen: ich liebe dich
>>
>> >> > > his english translation is not quite exact, but is probably better in
>> >> > > terms of versification:
>>
>> >> > > >> i want to sing in every language for you, baby, and play on every
>> >> > > instrument to say these words to you: believe me, it is true - i love
>> >> you
>>
>> >> > > however, my attempt in lojban is based on the german original:
>>
>> >> > > >> ni'o mi djica sanga bau ro bangu da .i mi se sance sepi'o ro zgitci
>> >> da
>> >> > > .i mi prami do .iu
>>
>> >> > > jbofi'e tells me, that this is grammatical, but is it "good lojban"
>> >> > > too? especially the construction with the two "da" seems a little
>> >> > > strange to me (although it might be practical, because it provides a
>> >> > > sort of rhyme). i would like to include the ".iu" at the very end of
>> >> > > the verse, because these emotional indicators are such a unique
>> >> > > feature of lojban - unless, of course, this should sound too awkward.
>>
>> >> > > i'd appreciate any ideas on this. also, if anyone has a translation,
>> >> > > that would fit better in the given meter or with a better rhyme, that
>> >> > > would be great! here's a link to the song:
>>
>> >> > >http://youtu.be/J2UBXB4IhZM
>>
>> >> > > thanks in advance!
>>
>> >> > > nils
>>
>> >> > > --
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>> >> > --
>> >> > mu'o mi'e .arpis.
>>
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