Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation

Well, since I no longer believe that UI is primarily for expressing (etc.) emotions (etc.), but about indicating spectra. I have only the logical problem -- shouldn't these be bridi? -- with 'dai' (which I never did have a problem with as empathetic emotion, only wondering why it was restricted to second person) or even 'da'ai' in its full unemotional form (assuming 'dai' can be extended to cover third party cases).

From: Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wed, December 1, 2010 7:59:54 PM
Subject: Re: [lojban] Time for the perenial other-centric-.ui conversation

On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Craig Daniel <craigbdaniel@gmail.com> wrote:

On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 8:54 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 6:32 PM, Craig Daniel <craigbdaniel@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 1, 2010 at 7:31 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Tue, Nov 30, 2010 at 6:01 PM, John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Why not, given that it is built on 'ie'?
>> >> Gee, I hope someone can do better than xorxes.
>> >
>> >
>> > Because of the bloody definition of the bloody word {pei}.
>> >
>> > UIdai is used to indicate another's UI-state, why do you have such a
>> > problem
>> > with UIpei, which is used to ask about it?
>>
>> UIdai is *not* used to indicate another's UI-state, but the speaker's
>> UI-state and the fact that it is empathetic in nature.
>
> empathetic
>
> Showing empathy for /others/, and recognizing their feelings etc
>
> empathy (uncountable)
>
> the intellectual identification of the thoughts, feelings, or state of
> /another person/

Yes, but .uidai represents empathetic happiness - a mood on the part
of the speaker which arises from identifying with someone else's
happiness.

I can conceivably imagine this being something other than happiness -
for instance, I can imagine expressing schadenfreude with ".ui.oidai"
- but it would certainly be unusual. Dai, however, is still about the
speaker's emotional state; in this, it differs from pei, which very
definitely is not.

I'll give you that. {da'ai} is the truly non-speaker one, but I'm on the side of the fence against that one.

--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.a'o.e'e ko cmima le bende pe lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

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